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Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 22:22:16 +1300
From: "G."
Subject: Re: Need help with modal chords for MIDI backing files

Hello there,
I'm not quite sure how much you do & don't understand, but hopefully some of
this will be useful or at least make it clearer....

I find sometimes spelling out chords & scales help.

D Dorian usually 3rd Pos of C
D E F G A B C D
So these are the notes you would prefer to stick to...

Now the chords:
In D Dorian you have:
1st, i, Dm, D F A and Dm7, D F A C
2nd, ii, Em, E G B and Em7, E G B D
4th, iv, Gm G B D and Gm7 , G B D F
5th, v, Am A C E and Am7, A C E G

All these notes are in D Dorian scale, so the quick answer is you can use
any of the above chords and still stay strictly in D Dorian mode without
wandering.

there is also...
6th, vi Bdim, B D F and Bm7flat5, B D F G
Which is also perfectly within D Dorian scale.

The cute thing about chords & scales is that the same combination of notes
can have different names and still be in a particular scale, but the
emphasis shifts depending on which chord you choose.

To take some of Windsavers examples...
Dm7, D F A C = F6, F A C D - same notes, but inverted as you noted
Dm9, D F A C E = Fmaj7/D, F A C E (D) - you could drop the D, or play it
anywhere.

Am7, A C E G = C6, C E G A - another inversion
Am9, A C E G B =Cmaj7/A, C E G B (A) - again A could be dropped,or play it
anywhere.

The half diminished VIth is also quite cool because it contains the same
notes as the Vth and tonic - this gives you freedom to shift through those
notes, useful for the (bars 8 & 9) I, V and (turn around) V, I changes - or
as as a substitution chord, or go between with other substitutions through
a bar.

Gm7, 5th, G B D F will move happily into
Bm7b5, 6th, B D F ~A~ Dm6, 1st, D F A B = F6/11, 3rd, F A B D

Dm6 will settle into Dm or Dm7 happily.
F6/11 will move happily into F7, or back to Gm7.
F7 will also go into Gm7, or you can take it back to Bm7b5.
(squz the notation)

Thats four legitimate chord substitutions all within D dorian.

So most of what Windsaver was suggesting still falls completely in the D
Dorian scale, but substituting different chords with the same notes....
which gives a different feel.

You had a couple of comments


There must be some trick to do this. Turning all my triads into diatonic
seventh chords sounds ok. Adding diatonic 9ths sounds ok. Adding
non-diatonic 7ths and 9ths sounds bad. Flatting 5ths sounds ok for minor
chords, bad for major. Moving into a diminished 7th chord actually sounds
quite good, but then I don't know where to go next. Trying to form half
diminished 7th chords in various inversions is giving me a headache.


Adding non diatonic notes will be by definition "outside" what you are
aiming to play.
With the diminished chord your best bet is to have a look at the above
spellings - you can safely resolve from Bdim to the minor fifth or the tonic
and sound good.... in the right places.

The trick is to lay out the notes and then find out what chords you can
spell with them. If you get most of the notes of one chord in another chord
that you have in the progression, then you can substitute with it. Sticking
to the rule of playing modally within D Dorian - well you just have a few
less choices than if you had all twelve notes at your disposal.


Substituting a ii-V for various chords sounds good too, especially when the
I implied by the ii-V is outside the original key.


Very cool and typical substitution in jazz. The ii is taking its root from
the fifth of the V...., thats why it resolves into it so well.... and stays
in the diatonic scale while doing so. :o)


But by modulating I'm
getting away from what I originally wanted to do: provide a backing for a
single diatonic harp playing in a mode.


Not if you modulate with D Dorian you're not. :)


Does this make sense? I don't expect to master anything overnight,
primarily I was wondering about chord progressions used to support modal
noodling. If anyone has any more tips I'd appreciate them.


Perfect sense.

As for your question about blues progressions for D Dorian harmonica -
you've put forward two perfectly good suggestions - I'll quote the minor
7ths version:

Dm7, Dm7, Dm7, Dm7,
Gm7, Gm7, Dm7, Dm7,
Am7, Gm7, Dm7, Am7...

Using the substitutions which I spelt out above you could do something like
this...

Dm7, F6, Dm9, F7, (substituting 3rd for 1st, 3rd goes into 4th happily)
Gm7, Bm7b5-Gm7, Dm6, Dm7 (diminished to IVth in one beat. Usin the Dm6th
carrying voices from the fourth)
Em7-Am7, Gm7, Dm7, C6... (ii-V, and C6 substituting 5th)

A variation of one of the Jazz blues progressions uses this:

Dm7 Gm7 Dm7 Dm,
Gm7 Gm7 Dm7 Dm7,
Em7 Gm7 Dm7 Dm7...

A little bit more information:
D minor (natural) usually 4th Pos of F
D E F G Ab B C D
D Blues (minor) usually 2nd Pos of G
D F G Ab A C D

And a final piece of advice - if you're keen to get into making backings,
safe your self a bunch of time & pain - get a copy of Band in the Box v11,
its only US$55 for the basic version through Amazon.Com and is an
invaluable practise tool, learning tool, ear training, its fantastic for
trying out different ideas and all sorts of things... making backing CDs, it
prints the score, it can produce solos based on Toots and Miles and Bela
Fleck and many others - and it goes on and on. :)

I'll flick you a MIDI with a 24 bar split into two 12 bars, the basic
version and the aforementioned substituted version I made up.

G.